Вот сделал подборку постов Twicwborn`a. Может кому поможет.
One thing Doug changed later in his life is that you DO NOT do the Power and Pump programs together in the same workout.
He felt the Pump program was overkill and probably did him more harm than good. 8 sets of 90% singles followed by a full 5x5 would kill any of us.
His refined training which he advised when older and wiser (in the late 90's before his death) went like this:
"A Routine" - Use Singles, start with 4 total and build up one rep per workout until you hit 10. (4 to 10 reps with 90%)
"B Routine" - Use triples and do the same progression. This was used when you went stale on the "A" routine, and was used until you were using the same weight for triples as you did for singles on "A" (12-30 reps with 75-80%)
You would do the "A" program until you went stale (and you WILL go stale, trust me) and then switch to the "B" routine for a few months. You don't pick and choose depending on the day,you use them in order, A/B/A/B... Doug thought the average guy could go 4 months on each before having to switch to the other program. THIS, he said, was the key to continued gains.
If using the "old style" workouts, you ALWAYS add the single reps to the FIRST sets until you hit the goal. For example:
3/3/3/3/3
4/3/3/3/3
5/3/3/3/3
5/4/3/3/3... and so on...
He said you should always do the added reps as soon as possible in the workout to maintain your energy. Don't add them at the end until its time to.
And not to be a jerk to Mike Mahler, but Doug would never superset (ie: A1/A2). He mentioned that he thought the idea was silly and it took away from focus on the lift you're working on. He liked total focus and would meditate between lifts. He was a big believer in self-hypnosis / autosuggestion.
I have been using these programs solely for more than 7 years. For such simple programs, they work better than anything else if you have the patience not to rush them.
To answer some questions:
I actually spoke to Doug several times back when I was an up-and-coming olympic lifter in the late 90's. He produced two full training videos showing him breaking strength records while he was 70 something years old. He strict pressed 205 ,one arm dumbell presses 110, and strict curled 160 if my memory serves me correctly. He outlined his full training program and all the rationale behind them in those videos, which im lucky to have gotten from him before he passed.
He would use TWO exercises a day, split into upper and lower body. He would overhead press and bench press one day, and squat and curl on the other. He used to shoot for two of the same workout in 8 days (one day on one day off) as his schedule and told me he had even better results at his age if he went one on two off.
He would progress from workout to workout. Always go to the gym seeking that ONE rep gain, no matter what. If you can do that you will ALWAYS progress!
As far as the pump sets go, he called them the "C" workout, and treated them separately.
At the end of his career he actually split up the two workouts "Power" and "Pump" and used them as I mentioned, one for a few months and the other for a few months.
First 3-4 months:
one set of 5 at 50%
60% x 1
70% x 1
80% x 1
4-10 singles @ 90% ("A Routine")
when you peak out and cant add any more weight...
Second 3-4 months:
one set of 5 at 50%
60% x 1
70% x 1
80% or thereabouts for 4-10 sets of 3 ("B Routine")
OR
80% for 3/3/3/3/3 building to 5/5/5/5/5 ("C Routine")
I know its confusing because most of the online information shows him using the power and pump phases together in the same workout, but he advised me NOT to do that, and mentions the same in his videos.
He simply came to the conclusion that its too much work for most people (and himself once he rounded 50 years old...)
I have Thurston's bio of him and it also mentions using them together. I can only imagine he used old articles to piece together Doug's training.
Doug advised me to just focus on using a single rep routine "A" for everything strength related. It worked, and I managed to push my Clean and Jerk up from 140 to 170kg using the "A" routine alone.
For the past few years I have been focusing on cycling the "A" and "B" routines together and managed to push my bench up to 480 starting on the bottom(started at 280 after a layoff)and my squat up to 660 from the bottom up.
I wanted to chime in when I saw this article because Doug helped me all those years ago, and I wanted to "say thanks" in a way. I really hope more of you guys give this a try, it will do wonders for you.
Last thing and MOST IMPORTANTLY.
Doug never used percents, he realized some guys could do more than others at a certain percent.
If I mentioned percents I am sorry, I was just trying to illustrate.
He said to take 5 reps with a light weight to start. Then add weight and do a single, add again for another single and add yet again for the last single. This was the warm up. a set of 5 and 3-4 singles to get to your working weight.
The next single would be at your working weight, which was "heavy enough to strain with but not your max". This was not necessarily 90% but thats what it averages out to for me. YOU MAY BE DIFFERENT.
Use a weight you strain with but can get 4 singles, and build up to 10.
If you do the "B" routine, use a weight you can get 4 triples with and build it up the same way.
If you use the "C" routine, stay with 5 sets but start with 3's and build them up to 5's.
THE "C" (PUMP) ROUTINE IS JUST A SHORTENED VERSION OF THE "B" ROUTINE! Use it if you dont want to hang around for 10 sets, simple as that.
Basically, its the Westside "max effort method" without going to absolute failure. You can see it on Prilepin's table when he tells you to do 4-10 sets of 90%...
Some things never change but boy do they WORK!
Best of luck, guys!
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I'll try to answer some questions:
To Lavi:
Nope, no prehab or any 'functional" work for that matter. Doug did mention something interesting though. When he broke his bench press records he used a collar to collar grip and a very wide bench which supported the entire shoulder joint.
I believe that no one needs prehab for their rotators, we need wider benches to keep our scapulae from getting crushed (and pening up the shoulder joint under stress) when handling a heavy weight. Couple that with heavy overhead pressing, heavy rows, and you won't have any shoulder trouble. (I personally never bench press, I floor press to keep my shoulders healthy. The week after I made a 500lb floor press I went to the bench to test and I made 480 comfortably, despite not training on a bench for 3 years. The strength carried over and I saved myself so much wear and tear...)
To Entheogens:
You read correctly, he kept on using the same exercises literally for decades, even into his 70's. He advised me to do the same, and I have.
John Davis used almost the same exact routine as Doug but without cycling it (just 8 sets of 1-3 reps at a fixed weight). When Davis would hit a wall, he would just change from singles to doubles or triples. Very simple. Cycling the intensity of effort (3's compared to 1's) is all the change anyone should ever need to make progress.
To Myodyne:
The metaphysical implications of "twiceborn" are exactly what I was after! You are correct, Doug was a VERY philosophical man, and seems to have tapped into a "universal truth" through his training style. He found a way to use his body to express his soul, and it was phenomenal.
Its nice to see someone like minded here that would notice such things.
I did not know that we were known as "digenes" in Greek, and I thank you very much for giving me a lead into my other lines of research. :-)
My sources are Doug himself, and his two videos and 5 booklets. He also had an old website with the transcript of his video which can still be accessed here:
http://web.archive.o...oughepburn.com/
I suggest everyone check out the "advanced training" article, and be sure to look at the PICTURES. Some incredible things there.
Best of luck everybody!
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One more thing:
PLEASE don't get caught up in the "increase 120lbs in a year" claims. it CAN be done, but it shouldn't be the goal.
Doug was very adamant that the only important part of training is making progress slowly and surely. He said he peaked in his MID 50's (390 strict standing press at age 54!!!) and he kept his strength until his death because it had a very solid foundation.
The gains will come but you can't get impatient and try to rush them, especially with this type of training.
Get to the gym, get your single rep gain, and be happy. In a few years you will look back and say "wow"
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Hey daisifu666,
The programs will work for bodybuilding (B and C primarily), but are not that great. There are better workouts for bodybuilding if pure strength is not your thing. 5x5 is a great in between program.
You can't cut on these programs, no way, they will kill you. I'm 260lbs and need to force feed myself to keep up, honestly. especially if you have a regular job. Starting out when you use lighter weights may be ok, but once you get into the big lifts, you will want to finish off a buffet yourself.
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Hey Ansleyl,
Judging by your goals, I would start out EXACTLY like this:
Monday:
Bench Press- 185x5/225x3/265x1/300x1
320 x 4-10 singles
Push Press- 135x5/195x3
235 x 4-10 singles
Bent Row- 50%x5/70%x3
85%x 4-10 singles
Thursday:
Squat- 225x5/270x3/320x1/365x1
385x 4-10 singles
Deadlift- 50%x1/70%x1
85%x 4-10 singles
Considering your ailments, I would not add any more volume, period. If you add anything, simply do one or two more warmups to get to your working weight and be totally loosened up. Perhaps add in some mobility drills between warmup sets as well.
At the beginning you will feel like 4 singles with 85% is too easy, and will be tempted to add something in. DONT!!! Its designed to be easy, its like a Westside style "deload" every few weeks. Going from 10 reps to 4 reps is a welcome change, trust me! lol 10 singles is a ball buster, you wont want (or need) any more volume.
Just train on Mondays and Thursdays. Also, use only 85% instead of 90% for your working weight. This will allow you to train more quickly, and progress faster. You should be able to do the singles with 2-3 minutes rest between them, using 90% is more like 5 minutes. So its just a quicker workout overall.
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My workouts from this week look like this:
Monday:
*self chiropractic adjustment beforehand
Floor Press:
260x5/365x3/445x 6 singles
Standing Press from Rack:
165x5/230x3/280x 6 singles
Barbell Curls:
170x 4 singles
Wednesday:
*self chiropractic adjustment beforehand
Squat from Bottom Position:
335x5/405x3/475x1/540x1/575x 7 singles
*needed more warmups, have a reconstructed knee
Barbell Row:
240x5/335x3/410 x 5 singles
...That's it! Simple, and straight to the point. I do these workouts at 5am before work, and they last until 6 or 6:15.
Today I will go in and do the exact same workout from Monday and try to add one single to eeach lift. I took Friday off because I felt like it. Simple as that.
I'm lifetime drug free, and have a reconstructed knee from a car accident in 2001. I started lifting again back in 2002 with a 280 bench, a 135 squat (yes, 135), 110 curl, and 185 row. I have never been injured in all this time of lifting on these routines, and slowly and progressively, I got to the levels you see.
I truly believe any of you can surpass what i'm doing, as well!
Hope this helps.
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Hey Ansleyl,
Only you can answer that. If the 6 sets of singles you did for each lift were relatively easy, then by all means keep on going!
If they felt good last time, then I would just do 7 singles with the same weights and see how it goes from there. You may be able to get more than 7, but stop there, hold yourself back a bit. It will work better that way.
After a while of holding yourself back your body gets really "antsy", it WANTS to lift a max and you'll start to crave a day to max out. its like storing up your nervous energy, and Doug equated it an "explosive force". (Im not exaggerating!) When this happens, re-test your maxes on a day you feel really good.
You'll blow your old PR's out of the water, and probably do more than your working weight would lead you to believe possible!
Then switch to the "B" routine. Using these new maxes, use 75-80% for 4 sets of triples. Build up to 10 sets (add one set a workout). Give me a PM in 6-8 months when you're using 300 for push presses, and 400 for benches. :-)
If your body starts acting up on you, dont be afraid to drop back to the "B" routine sooner, but I really think you'll be just fine. Working with singles is incredibly safe in my opinion.
You're back on your way!
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Humanhorrorfilm,
Honestly, I would use the "A" routine to train maximum strength events, like partial deadlift, log lift, and the stones (if your gym has a full set or a loadable stone trainer) I do think you'd have good results with pure strength events like those.
So much of strongman is strength-endurance and this routine was not designed for it. Any events that are endurance would have to be trained totally separately.
When you ARE lifting in the gym, definitely use the "A" routine for things like deadlifts, push press, and squats - they all work great.
I would use the singles with 85-90% twice a week for these lifts, and do your events on the weekend for maxes. You could rotate your weekend events like a westside max effort or you could use a single rep progression each week like these routines.
If you had a certain contest in mind and a list of events, it would be easier to figure out.
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peterm533
You build from 4 reps to 10, then start over 5-10lbs heaver with 4 reps again.
However, it may take 6 weeks to build up like that, and most times you will feel the desire to test your max before you get to 10.
Thats just fine. you test your max, and use your new max to determine a new 85-90%. This is more effective if you can hold back from testing for a few months, but hell, I honestly do it every 2-3 months regardless of where I am in my cycle.
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hey Humanhorrorfilm,
"I pretty much hit events hard every other week, so i was thinking of having two gym workouts, just rotate from one to the other, only hitting them twice on events weeks, and maybe 3 times on non-events weeks, kinda like 1-2-1-2-1-2, etc."
Your layout looks sound enough and should work fine for your needs.
Sorry if I got confusing in my responses, the stuff I'm going on is different than that Mike Mahler used in the article. As I refer to them, the "A" routine is 4-10 sets of singles with 85-90%.
"B" is 4-10 sets of triples at 75-80%.
"C" (Pump sets) are 4-10 sets of 5's at 65-70%, -OR- 5 sets of 3 building up to 5 sets of 5 one rep at a time. (this is used when short on time)
Your workout layout is also just fine, but if you have any trouble recovering, switch to this:
Workout 1:
Floor Press
Clean and Press
BB Rows
Workout 2-
Squat
Deadlift
Chins
The only problem I see you having is mixing lower and upper body work in the same workout.
I would Floor Press the same day as overhead work, and do it first. You will be better warmed up and the heavy floor presses will get your nervous system firing and let you use more weight on the overhead work. Doing overhead first or separately never seems to work as well for me.
Squat and deadlift are the same deal. When I squat first I can usually jump right in to my working weight in the deadlift without a problem, skipping warmups completely and saving energy. By that time I am usually drenched in sweat and thoroughly "warm", lol My back seems stronger grouping them together. I also get more rest between hitting those same muscles than if I split them into two workouts.
I squatted yesterday actually, and am not fatigued at all. The singles are really easy to recover from, but the triples are a bit more taxing.
Jump in and give your program a try, and if you run into any issues with recovery, just try grouping things around as I said. You should have no problems.
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Humanhorrorfilm,
Hey, no problem my friend, just hope I can help.
"Do you think its detrimental to mix singles/triples, maybe one session all singles to inimize fatigue, then have the next session by all triples, or just go with one or the other?"
I honestly have never tried doing one exercise with singles and another with triples as you showed in your outline. I can see where you're coming from and it might work well.
I have always done ALL my exercises with "A" or "B" at the same time. Sometimes I might be hitting 6 sets on floor press and 4 on overhead or something like that, but thats as different between exercises as I get.
I find if I keep everything "together" then I have one workout of 20 singles or triples in 90 minutes followed by a workout of 8 singles or triples total in 40 minutes. This is the built in deload and it happens every three weeks or so. My body is used to it by now, and the periods of less volume are very welcome.
Mixing things up might not give you the same effect as that period of deload.
One thing Doug DID mention is that you gain strength quicker with the singles (A) than the triples (
and he used the triples as a prolonged deload for when he was just shot physically.
You might want to hit a Major competition by training with the "A" to get as strong as possible, then switch to "B" after your season is over or a minor competiton you don't need to be in top shape for. You will still progress, but a bit more slowly and recovering at the same time.
If you do try mixing, let us know how it works, I am very curious myself!
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strongfan,
Two different days. The last day of the cycle at one weight (two exercises, ten reps each) followed a few days later by the first day of the new cycle at the new weight (two exercises- four reps each). This is the deload period, or as Doug put it, the "reprise".
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так я и не делаю..3-5 - это низкоповторка, обычная для меня в тяге..
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